How Australia is monitoring Islamic State supporters inside their borders

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  • JUDY WOODRUFF:

    A short time ago, I spoke via Skype to Sydney-based journalist Stuart Cohen, who's been covering the story and the ongoing politics investigation.

    Stuart Cohen, thank you for talking with us.

    What evidence, first of all, did police have before they arrested these suspects?

  • STUART COHEN, Freelance Journalist:

    Well, obviously, as with any sort of intelligence operation, they're playing their cards very close to the vest.

    But one thing that they did let out was that the raids that took place in Sydney were based on an intercepted phone call between that senior ISIS militant, that senior Australian ISIS militant that Tony Abbott mentioned in the piece before, and Omarjan Azari, who was the 22 year old who is the only person that has actually been charged in these arrests so far.

    So that's the one piece of intelligence that they did let slip, that they had intercepted a phone call, and that was what sort of put this whole operation in motion, realizing that they were close to possibly carrying out these attacks.

  • JUDY WOODRUFF:

    And what made them think that these individuals were actually going to carry them out?

  • STUART COHEN:

    Well, they have been having these people under surveillance for a while. That's the best that the police would say. They have been watching these people.

    Obviously, they had reason ever since the terror alert was raised last week to high, which means that the terror alert is now — or a terror attack is now likely in Australia, they have been putting some increased scrutiny on people. They know where the radical Islamic element is in Sydney, and they keep a lot of these people under surveillance. And they figured the time was right.

    It was time to get in there and start making arrests before the worst thing could happen and they could carry out some sort of an attack.

  • JUDY WOODRUFF:

    In fact, I was reading one report that said that they estimate that there are about 100 people inside Australia now who are actively supporting the Islamic State group. If they know that much about them, why haven't they arrested more?

  • STUART COHEN:

    Well, I guess in some ways, you have to wait for a crime to occur. They're keeping a watch on people. There are people, like you said, about 100 people who they believe are supporting the I.S. movement either through fund-raising or helping to recruit people to send overseas.

    In fact, they did arrest two people last week in a raid in Brisbane and charged them with supporting the Islamic State movement through raising funds and helping to recruit jihadists to send overseas. So those two people were arrested. They're keeping an eye on the other 100 or so that they believe have links to the movement.

    And then, of course, there are 60 people that they think, 60 or so people they think are overseas actively fighting for the I.S. movement. Some of those people, they have already canceled their passports. They have issued arrest warrants for some of them. If they ever return to Australia, they will be arrested, but the question is if those people come back.

    And, obviously, that's a big concern is when and if those people who are fighting overseas start coming back. That's what gives the government cause for concern.

  • JUDY WOODRUFF:

    Do they have a theory about why this was going to happen or they were trying to make it happen in Australia? Is it because Australia is about to send troops over to fight the Islamic State group? Or what do you hear about that?

  • STUART COHEN:

    Well, part of it is. I think there are some senior members of the opposition in parliament who are having the same concern, that because of the commitment of 600 troops to the coalition that's going to fight the Islamic State, that that makes Australia a bigger target for a domestic terrorist attack.

    But like a lot of places around the world, like the U.S. and the U.K., there are a lot of immigrants, a lot of Muslim immigrants. And there are going to be a sort of disaffected, marginalized minority that find no home in their adopted country. And the only thing that they resort to is radical Islam.

    And they find a welcome home among a certain community that wants to carry out these attacks. Australia, as a Western nation and as a backer of U.S. policy, a very strong backer of U.S. policy, finds itself a target for these people.

  • JUDY WOODRUFF:

    Stuart, last question. How is the Australian public reacting to this, especially there in Sydney?

  • STUART COHEN:

    Well, I think people are quite surprised. I think it's going to take a little bit longer to see how things shake out.

    Obviously, the initial reaction is quite a bit of surprise, especially in some of the neighborhoods where people find that they have suspected terrorists living among them. A lot of these arrests took place in very immigrant-rich communities. A lot of the people around there still can't believe that some of the people within their neighborhoods were even arrested and still don't believe that they had anything to do.

    There is a certain degree of belief that maybe the government has been overinflating this terror risk to sort of distract the public from some rather unpopular domestic policies that are going on right now.

  • JUDY WOODRUFF:

    So not widespread fear?

  • STUART COHEN:

    Not widespread fear at this point. There hasn't been an attack here. There has never been a terrorist attack in Australia.

  • JUDY WOODRUFF:

    Reporter Stuart Cohen in Sydney, we thank you.

  • STUART COHEN:

    You're welcome, Judy.

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